[gareth]

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[jmcw]

gareth, on 2011-October-19, 14:31, said:

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If partner needed me to bid he could have called 4NT, so X gives me options.
My hand is pretty decent for defence. expect this to go down...PASS

[Fluffy]

I have ♣QJ how can pass be an option?

[Hanoi5]

Fluffy, on 2011-October-19, 15:02, said:

I have ♣QJ how can pass be an option?

I have a Pass card in my bidding box, how could it not be an option?

I think the 5-level is kinda scary being Red I'd pass with the given hand but partner's double is not for penalty.

[dwar0123]

I have an undisclosed defensive trick, partner isn't doubling on distribution but on strength, else he would bid something else.

Pass.

[MrAce]

Fluffy, on 2011-October-19, 15:02, said:

I have ♣QJ how can pass be an option?

Pass is hell of an option, whether u choose it or not is another story.

It is very close call imo. But over the years i learnt that each time opponents bid 1M-4M and buy it, we are in their comfort zone. I would bid 5♣ and hope one of them is void in ♣ or pd is void in ♠ or it is the right call. And if not there is always a chance that opponents may bite it and make my wrong bid right. I cant disagree with passers though.

[Zelandakh]

MrAce, on 2011-October-20, 01:10, said:

Pass is hell of an option, whether u choose it or not is another story.

It is very close call imo. But over the years i learnt that each time opponents bid 1M-4M and buy it, we are in their comfort zone. I would bid 5♣ and hope one of them is void in ♣ or pd is void in ♠ or it is the right call. And if not there is always a chance that opponents may bite it and make my wrong bid right. I cant disagree with passers though.

If partner were void in spades, would they not bid 4NT in preference to X?

[the hog]

Not pass, especially not with QJx of clubs as per Fluffy. I would bid 4NT scrambling.

[han]

I think this is not an easy decision. On auctions like this I play partner to have a good 1-3-3-6 hand, something like x Axx KQx AKxxxx is possible (although that is a nicely fitting maximum, partner could have a bit less). If partner has that hand then both games could be down, but on a different layout both could be making. A hand like x Ax Kxx AKxxxxx is also possible, here 4S might make and 5C is cold. It's also possible to construct hands where neither game has chances.

I'm bidding 5C, aware that this could easily be wrong.

I don't understand 4NT, we have a good club fit.

[mcphee]

5C seems to me a no brainer, we may even make it. I am not sure what he has exactly, but partner thinks he has a good hand and I am confident 5C should have a chance. I am more inclined to place partner with 6C as with 1-4-3-5 shape they might have doubled.This ace should be more value on offense than defense.

[kenrexford]

han, on 2011-October-20, 04:56, said:

I think this is not an easy decision. On auctions like this I play partner to have a good 1-3-3-6 hand, something like x Axx KQx AKxxxx is possible (although that is a nicely fitting maximum, partner could have a bit less). If partner has that hand then both games could be down, but on a different layout both could be making. A hand like x Ax Kxx AKxxxxx is also possible, here 4S might make and 5C is cold. It's also possible to construct hands where neither game has chances.

I'm bidding 5C, aware that this could easily be wrong.

I don't understand 4NT, we have a good club fit.

4NT does not commit us to a red contract, IMO.

If partner has 1336 or even more clubs, he can safely bid 5♣ over 4NT because I can safely counter with 5♦, meaning -- no really, pick a red suit.

On the other hand, if partner in fact has a 4-card red suit, I think this might be a better strain. Clubs surely is safer, but a red suit makes more often, IMO.

[whereagles]

Pard should have like 15-16 hcp and probably a 1336 or thereabouts. We'll probably make 9-10 tricks in clubs, so a save seems to be good... but do opps have 4S? Probably not. I'm going to pass.

[kenrexford]

More thought on this one.

If partner had 4♦/6♣, he might have opted 4NT himself. Double sounds somewhat like 4♥/6♣ is a possibility (especially as no ELC is possible). If he has that, give him a possible hand:

♠x ♥AKxx ♦xx ♣AKxxxx

Opposite that, 5♣ has no play. You just lose one in each suit, even with a 3-2 heart split.

But, what about 5♥? If you are fortunate enough to catch the person with long hearts (on a 3-2 split) also having long diamonds, which is likely going to be Opener, even a diamond lead does not stop 5♥. Plus, partner is allowed to have the heart Jack also.

So, if you are going to bid, 4NT seems right, IMO. The question is whether to bid or not.

[gnasher]

5♣. Defending with an undisclosed fit never seems to work for me.

The thought of playing in a red suit makes me feel slightly ill. Doesn't the auction suggest bad breaks?

[jdeegan]

Couple of random thoughts:
1. Pard doesn't have enough to double the first time with the plan to bid later.
2. Pard has a good enough hand he feels the need to double later in order to protect our equity.
This strikes me as a rather narrow window: ♣ AK, ♥ AK and maybe ♦ K???? That hand will usually set 4♠ by about 2 tricks and counts to 10 tricks (more or less) off the top in 5♣ with decent prospects for an 11th trick somewhere. The decision does seem rather close between pass and 5♣. Kinda depends on the intangibles imo. Who are the opps, what is the state of the game, how does the table feel??? Given no input there I guess I would be inclined to pass but only by a little.

[the_dude]

I routinely leave these doubles in, and I routinely get bad boards doing it.

However, since I never seem to learn from my mistakes, I would likely pass on this one too.

[gareth]

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I don't understand 4NT; it seems more likely to locate a bad fit than a good one.

At the other table South doubled first and felt obliged to bid 5C next, and ended in 6Cx.
I think 2C then double seems better (as long as your partner remembers to take out your take out doubles when holding a fit) as you still have the chance of defending opposite a misfit.

[xxhong]

I think south made three mistakes. The first one is 2C, this hand is way too strong for a 2C overcall, you need very little from partner to have a play 4H, like Hxxxxxx is often enough. Double is a clear cut IMO.
The second is the double. 7-4 distribution strongly suggests to play usually. 4NT is clear to show 6C and 4+ side suit. 6C is also rather bad, partner may hold CQxxx and nothing else in this auction.

Still, 6C is not a bad contract.

gareth, on 2011-October-24, 07:23, said:

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I don't understand 4NT; it seems more likely to locate a bad fit than a good one.

At the other table South doubled first and felt obliged to bid 5C next, and ended in 6Cx.
I think 2C then double seems better (as long as your partner remembers to take out your take out doubles when holding a fit) as you still have the chance of defending opposite a misfit.

[the hog]

gareth, on 2011-October-24, 07:23, said:

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I don't understand 4NT; it seems more likely to locate a bad fit than a good one.

At the other table South doubled first and felt obliged to bid 5C next, and ended in 6Cx.
I think 2C then double seems better (as long as your partner remembers to take out your take out doubles when holding a fit) as you still have the chance of defending opposite a misfit.

Nonsense. on this hand partner will bid 5C over 4NT. 4NT could easily locate a nice D fit.
I am glad to see that those who passed the double of 4S got what they deserved.

[whereagles]

hoggie, ye calvinist... punishment of the guilty of passing LOL