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R vs W at IMPs you hold:
------
Axxxx
Txxxxx
Tx
LHO deals:
(2♠) - P - (4♠) - P
(P) - X - (P) - ?
What if it were Equal or W vs R vulnerability... Would this affect your decision?
How Bad? A horrible tale from Atlanta
#1
- Vesuvius the Violent Volcano
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Posted 2009-September-08, 19:52
Yay for the "Ignored Users" feature!
#2
- Brain Farts and Actual Farts Increasing with Age
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Posted 2009-September-08, 20:07
4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."
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-P.J. Painter.
#3
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Posted 2009-September-08, 20:20
kenrexford, on Sep 8 2009, 09:07 PM, said:
4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then.
clearly you don't think partner had a penalty pass of 2♠
"Tell me of your home world, Usul"
the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
George Bernard Shaw
the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
George Bernard Shaw
#4
- Brain Farts and Actual Farts Increasing with Age
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Posted 2009-September-08, 20:26
pooltuna, on Sep 8 2009, 09:20 PM, said:
kenrexford, on Sep 8 2009, 09:07 PM, said:
4NT. If partner picks clubs, 5♦ to pick a red suit. If partner picks diamonds, OK then.
clearly you don't think partner had a penalty pass of 2♠
I may be wrong, but I don't think this double means that I should pass with this hand.
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."
-P.J. Painter.
-P.J. Painter.
#5
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Posted 2009-September-08, 20:50
Really really bad (assuming we are talking about something other than the auto Pass).
That's impossible. No one can give more than one hundred percent. By definition that is the most anyone can give.
#6
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Posted 2009-September-08, 21:08
Wait a minute. I just noticed the colors as red on white. That's a little tougher. Now I'm doubting...
"Gibberish in, gibberish out. A trial judge, three sets of lawyers, and now three appellate judges cannot agree on what this law means. And we ask police officers, prosecutors, defense lawyers, and citizens to enforce or abide by it? The legislature continues to write unreadable statutes. Gibberish should not be enforced as law."
-P.J. Painter.
-P.J. Painter.
#7
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Posted 2009-September-08, 21:22
If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round.
"The King of Hearts a broadsword bears, the Queen of Hearts a rose." W. H. Auden.
#8
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Posted 2009-September-08, 21:37
The_Hog, on Sep 8 2009, 10:22 PM, said:
If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round.
yep. If pard couldn't act the first time because the shape was wrong for takeout, and if he couldn't bid NT the first time --and didn't want to show a two-suit gamble with 4NT, he/she would stay fixed. Partner is not asking me to bid. Would not be surprised if we get four trump tricks.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
#9
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Posted 2009-September-09, 04:13
If pds X is penalty, and can't play in either ♦'s or ♥'s opposite this hand, then he should have passed, not X'd. So 4NT is absolutely clear. If pd doesn't like it, get a new pd!
Bill
Bill
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Posted 2009-September-09, 04:56
bill1157, on Sep 9 2009, 07:13 PM, said:
If pds X is penalty, and can't play in either ♦'s or ♥'s opposite this hand, then he should have passed, not X'd. So 4NT is absolutely clear. If pd doesn't like it, get a new pd!
Bill
Bill
I am afraid you won't get many new partners from the BBFlers.
Kind Regards
Roland
Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
Roland
Sanity Check: Failure (Fluffy)
More system is not the answer...
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Posted 2009-September-09, 05:34
I say don't do this double undiscussed. These 2-way doubles of penalty or takeout depending on the number of enemy's trumps can sometimes work out badly.
So...how fast was partner's pass over 2S and his X?
So...how fast was partner's pass over 2S and his X?
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We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
We are all connected to each other biologically, to the Earth chemically, and to the rest of the universe atomically.
We're in the universe, and the universe is in us.
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Posted 2009-September-09, 07:27
kenrexford, on Sep 8 2009, 10:08 PM, said:
Wait a minute. I just noticed the colors as red on white. That's a little tougher. Now I'm doubting...
....sanity? No Problem! We can confirm. You are definitely insane
"Tell me of your home world, Usul"
the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
George Bernard Shaw
the Freman, Chani from the move "Dune"
"I learned long ago, never to wrestle with a pig. You get dirty, and besides, the pig likes it."
George Bernard Shaw
#13
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Posted 2009-September-09, 07:53
aguahombre, on Sep 8 2009, 08:37 PM, said:
The_Hog, on Sep 8 2009, 10:22 PM, said:
If partner does not have a penalty double of 4S, then I am finding another partner. If pd had a takeout double, she would have doubled on the last round.
yep. If pard couldn't act the first time because the shape was wrong for takeout, and if he couldn't bid NT the first time --and didn't want to show a two-suit gamble with 4NT, he/she would stay fixed. Partner is not asking me to bid. Would not be surprised if we get four trump tricks.
Good , helpful answers, good thread , thanks
It is not because things are difficult that we do not dare, it is because we do not dare that they are difficult.
"You need to play a lot of stuff these days just to deal with the stuff your opponents are playing" DBurn
"You need to play a lot of stuff these days just to deal with the stuff your opponents are playing" DBurn
#14
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Posted 2009-September-09, 08:01
That's the thing with penalty doubles. P has five or six spades (or four good ones) so it doesn't surprise him that we are void. Should he abstain from making a penalty double because he is afraid we would pull it? Well if this double were a little bid optional then yes.
But it isn't. You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either. This is one of the few situations in modern biding were partner doesn't ask us to do something intelligent. He just asks us to pass.
But it isn't. You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either. This is one of the few situations in modern biding were partner doesn't ask us to do something intelligent. He just asks us to pass.
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Posted 2009-September-09, 08:17
You should give this problem blind without the 'benefit' of looking at your hand.
This is far from a WTP.
This is far from a WTP.
Hi y'all!
Winner - BBO Challenge bracket #6 - February, 2017.
Winner - BBO Challenge bracket #6 - February, 2017.
#16
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Posted 2009-September-09, 09:13
helene_t, on Sep 9 2009, 09:01 AM, said:
You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either.
Well, this would be true, except we haven't preempted, they did.
Is the word "pass" not in your vocabulary?
So many experts, not enough X cards.
So many experts, not enough X cards.
#17
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Posted 2009-September-09, 09:20
I cannot come up with a rational explanation for the double other than penalty. Any other explanation is impossible given the failure to act over 2♠. The fact that I am void in spades is consistent with the penalty double. Spades are 6-5-2 or 6-6-1 around the table, and RHO has a very good hand.
The only problem with the double is that RHO may run to a different contract. But that is not my problem - that is partner's problem. Presumably he took that into account when he doubled 4♠.
The only problem with the double is that RHO may run to a different contract. But that is not my problem - that is partner's problem. Presumably he took that into account when he doubled 4♠.
#18
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Posted 2009-September-09, 09:27
If partner really wanted to "takeout", he would bid 4N. Additionally, it's somewhat difficult to construct a hand that could not make a takeout X of 2S but now wants to make one of 4S.
I don't even need to see my hand.
Pass, wtp?
I don't even need to see my hand.
Pass, wtp?
Is the word "pass" not in your vocabulary?
So many experts, not enough X cards.
So many experts, not enough X cards.
#19
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Posted 2009-September-09, 09:53
bid_em_up, on Sep 9 2009, 10:13 AM, said:
helene_t, on Sep 9 2009, 09:01 AM, said:
You don't pull partner's penalty double after you have preempted and opps bid in your void, either.
Well, this would be true, except we haven't preempted, they did.
Hence Helene's use of the word 'either'.
That's impossible. No one can give more than one hundred percent. By definition that is the most anyone can give.
#20
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Posted 2009-September-09, 11:05
Partner likely won't have double based on trump tricks. (If he does, the opps suck so much... or are trying stuff) I think most likely partner has something like 12-15 count balanced with one certain trump trick and 2-3 other likely(certain) tricks. We have one ace for pard so pass is clear cut. Without that, I would be pulling of course.