[Fluffy]

The reason why gerber is mocked I guess its because its one of those conventions that is widely missused.

On my land nobody knows about gerber, but they missuse blackwood the most, using it for hands that want to invite to slam.

Inviting to slam is way more likely than having slam but having to check for keycards before bidding it. 4 clubs is very useful for a variety of slam invites like splinter, natural, cuebid, etc.

[ArtK78]

Fluffy, on 2015-December-13, 18:10, said:

The reason why gerber is mocked I guess its because its one of those conventions that is widely missused.

On my land nobody knows about gerber, but they missuse blackwood the most, using it for hands that want to invite to slam.

Inviting to slam is way more likely than having slam but having to check for keycards before bidding it. 4 clubs is very useful for a variety of slam invites like splinter, natural, cuebid, etc.

So Gerber would be an improvement for them. They could misuse Gerber and be a level lower.

[helene_t]

ArtK78, on 2015-December-13, 19:57, said:

So Gerber would be an improvement for them. They could misuse Gerber and be a level lower.

Not really. Pairs who play "4NT is always blackwood" rarely have misunderstandings about it. They are sometimes stuck for a bid when they have a quantitative 4NT bid but that should not be a top priority for most club players.

Club-level gerberist have basically two options:
- 4♣ is always Gerber. Needless to say that is terrible.
- 4♣ is sometimes Gerber. Leads to tons of misunderstandings.

[Cyberyeti]

helene_t, on 2015-December-14, 04:23, said:

Not really. Pairs who play "4NT is always blackwood" rarely have misunderstandings about it. They are sometimes stuck for a bid when they have a quantitative 4NT bid but that should not be a top priority for most club players.

Club-level gerberist have basically two options:
- 4♣ is always Gerber. Needless to say that is terrible.
- 4♣ is sometimes Gerber. Leads to tons of misunderstandings.

Or option 3 which is not uncommon, only Gerber directly over a natural 1N or 2N opener (with 2♣-2♦-2N and the multi equivalent included) which almost never has misunderstandings until you try to ask for kings.

[StevenG]

helene_t, on 2015-December-14, 04:23, said:

- 4♣ is sometimes Gerber. Leads to tons of misunderstandings.

That used to work quite well when Gerber was alertable. If the expected alert did not happen, it was emphasised by a long hard glare. Partner got the message.

Fortunately that method no longer works.

[diana_eva]

When I first started playing bridge I learned 4C always gerber as part of the start-up kit and used it for a long time. It was one of the few conventions I loved because most of the times when partner opened and I had something like a 14-15 count or heaven forbid even more I had no clue how to bid on. Gerber was easy: ask aces. If we have them, bid slam, if not, bid game. I don't remember who taught me out of it and how they managed that, was definitely one of my favorite things in bridge lol

[zillahandp]

Lovely example years ago your partnership got wrong and lost out, how long to get thar back? And cyberyeti great hand let me know when it happens, meanwhile count the cock ups people have with the convention.

[iandayre]

The most useful, if not terribly common, situation for Gerber using modern methods is after a 1NT opening bid and a Stayman rebid showing a major suit. This would indeed be RKC Gerber, including the K of the agreed suit.

[timevell]

I'm no expert by any means but after reading some of these posts i see why gerber isn't used effectively. You never use gerber when a suit is agreed on. Only when no suit is agreed on, a natural NT bid has been made and 4c must be a jump bid. Under these circumstances it works great. What I don't see is control bids and seldom quantitative bids. Blackwood and RKC are often used at the wrong time and cause problems. My opinion.

[ArtK78]

timevell, on 2015-December-14, 22:06, said:

I'm no expert by any means but after reading some of these posts i see why gerber isn't used effectively. You never use gerber when a suit is agreed on. Only when no suit is agreed on, a natural NT bid has been made and 4c must be a jump bid. Under these circumstances it works great. What I don't see is control bids and seldom quantitative bids. Blackwood and RKC are often used at the wrong time and cause problems. My opinion.

I strongly disagree with your first point. It is very possible to use Gerber effectively when a suit is agreed upon in certain circumstances. The partnership must have a very specific set of rules when 4♣ (or, for that matter, some other bid) is Gerber.

The most common agreement to use 4♣ as Gerber when a suit is agreed is 1NT - 2♣ - 2♥/♠ - 4♣. But there may be other situations where 4♣ is Gerber following suit agreement.

[fromageGB]

Cyberyeti, on 2015-December-13, 12:22, said:

OK, so I have x, KQx, KQJxxxxx, x - partner has AKQJ, xx(x), xx(x), AKQJ and we have nowhere to go when partner bids above 5♦ even 4N is not safe, after gerber I can play 5♦.

So transfer to diamonds, 4♥ ace ask, and still stop in 5♦. No need for Gerber, but there is a need for an ace ask other than 4NT.
Even if you are not playing kickback as a matter of course, surely using this 4♥ as an ace ask is more useful than a splinter - or what do you use it for?

[Cyberyeti]

fromageGB, on 2015-December-16, 05:22, said:

So transfer to diamonds, 4♥ ace ask, and still stop in 5♦. No need for Gerber, but there is a need for an ace ask other than 4NT.
Even if you are not playing kickback as a matter of course, surely using this 4♥ as an ace ask is more useful than a splinter - or what do you use it for?

This was in response to something saying super gerber 5♣ was the answer. Of course 4♥ will do as well and is what I could use (after a 3♦ slammish response rather than a transfer), but in practice I'd prob just gerber.