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Settle and argument Pass or Pull

Poll: Settle and argument (48 member(s) have cast votes)

What would you bid?

  1. Pass (45 votes [93.75%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 93.75%

  2. 5D (2 votes [4.17%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.17%

  3. I am a crazy person (other) (1 votes [2.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 2.08%

Does partners double promise diamond support?

  1. Yes (2 votes [4.17%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.17%

  2. No (28 votes [58.33%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 58.33%

  3. Promises Tolerance (13 votes [27.08%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 27.08%

  4. Is a pure penalty double. (5 votes [10.42%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 10.42%

You think bidding 5D is:

  1. Clear (0 votes [0.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 0.00%

  2. Correct (2 votes [4.17%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 4.17%

  3. Questionable (11 votes [22.92%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 22.92%

  4. Wrong (20 votes [41.67%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 41.67%

  5. Insane (15 votes [31.25%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 31.25%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#1 User is offline   phil_20686 

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Posted 2012-October-24, 19:01



So your opponents are acol players. Which means that 1C promises four clubs. In practice this sequence guarantees an unbalanced hand with 5 clubs and 4 hearts. North cannot have any balanced hand (i.e. not 18-19 NT). Bid, or not?
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#2 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-October-24, 20:47

The part about Diamond support or tolerance is tricky. IMO, it doesn't "promise" Diamond support, but my hand pattern suggests she has a couple of them. So, I answered NO.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#3 User is offline   BunnyGo 

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Posted 2012-October-24, 21:14

I'm not bidding, and the caddy on the other side of the room isn't either.
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#4 User is offline   JLOGIC 

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Posted 2012-October-24, 22:28

Easy pass to me, I have a stiff spade and clubs locked up. Would not even think about bidding for >1 second
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#5 User is offline   gszes 

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Posted 2012-November-01, 13:04

 phil_20686, on 2012-October-24, 19:01, said:



So your opponents are acol players. Which means that 1C promises four clubs. In practice this sequence guarantees an unbalanced hand with 5 clubs and 4 hearts. North cannot have any balanced hand (i.e. not 18-19 NT). Bid, or not?



There are very few hands p will x with that are perfect for us to make 5d for ex will p
x with say AQxxx Kxx Qxx xx? probably not. P is much more likely to x with a holding
like AKQxx xxx Qx xxx. So IMO bidding 5d will probably be wrong far too often and there
is a decent chance we will be able to crush 4h.

PASS
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#6 User is offline   Codo 

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Posted 2012-November-01, 13:08

Pass is so obvious, it must be wrong.
Kind Regards

Roland

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#7 User is offline   BunnyGo 

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Posted 2012-November-01, 15:49

I'd be interested in hearing Fluffy's reasoning for bidding.
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#8 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-November-01, 18:28

 BunnyGo, on 2012-November-01, 15:49, said:

I'd be interested in hearing Fluffy's reasoning for bidding.

He doesn't like unanimous polls.
"Bidding Spades to show spades can work well." (Kenberg)
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#9 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2012-November-01, 19:25

I missed partner being a passed hand, I hate to leave take out doubles on this vul when I have shape. But being a passed hand its perhaps too much. The other reason for being alone is maybe that I voted without looking at any coment of vote :)
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#10 User is offline   phil_20686 

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Posted 2012-November-12, 03:33

Thought I should put up the whole hand:


The physics is theoretical, but the fun is real. - Sheldon Cooper
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#11 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2012-November-12, 21:55

Thought I should put up the whole hand:

S-ruff at opening lead or winning HA sets 4H.
Spade opening lead and wait for DA +HK +CQ to set 5D.
Both close contracts. THIS time.
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#12 User is offline   Fluffy 

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Posted 2012-November-13, 03:28

set 5♦ dake? really?
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#13 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2012-November-29, 08:15

:P W's double is really bad. He has TWO defensive tricks. Your overcall doesn't really promise ANY defensive tricks at all. So, if the double is for penalties, it is from hunger.

If the double means something else, then what does it mean? W missed the boat (on this particular hand) when he bid 1♠ rather than raising diamonds. Not that bidding 1♠ was wrong, but his LHO jammed the auction, so his diamond support got buried. Too bad, but on some hands you just have to stay fixed. You can't just arbitrarily say that a double showed secondary diamond support just because it happened to work on this particular hand.
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#14 User is offline   Cyberyeti 

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Posted 2012-November-29, 09:28

 jdeegan, on 2012-November-29, 08:15, said:

:P W's double is really bad. He has TWO defensive tricks. Your overcall doesn't really promise ANY defensive tricks at all. So, if the double is for penalties, it is from hunger.


Is this true for most people ? 1♦ over 1♣ consumes no space so in my world is the soundest of my overcalls and shows a decent hand.
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#15 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2012-November-29, 13:34

 Cyberyeti, on 2012-November-29, 09:28, said:

Is this true for most people ? 1♦ over 1♣ consumes no space so in my world is the soundest of my overcalls and shows a decent hand.

:P True, and you are vul vs non-vul as well. Still, your overcall might be a lead director or based on a longer than normal suit. I have my doubts about 4♥ making, but there is no 'doubt' card in my bidding box.
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#16 User is offline   dake50 

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Posted 2012-November-30, 08:44

set 5♦ dake? really? -- Fluffy

*** Play 5D to not lose DA +HK +[C-ruff or lose control in a crossruff plan]
*** Propose your play. Even double dummy!
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#17 User is offline   aguahombre 

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Posted 2012-November-30, 08:56

Dake:

Non heart lead, otherwise we are going for 6.

Win Spade lead, hook club, draw trumps...heart suit is frozen for lefty, so we eventually get to use the heart ace for second club hook.

With trump lead, win and draw trumps. first club hook occurs when we win the spade ace in dummy, second hook when we eventually lead a heart to dummy's ace.

With Club lead, draw trumps and do same thing.
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#18 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2012-November-30, 14:54

:P This hand and thread illustrates an excellent point that even very good players sometimes overlook. Finding a winning defense is often far from a sure thing. On this hand the defense has two chances (1) Ace and a spade at trick one (not very damn likely in an honest game). (2) Ace and a spade at trick three.

I have been kibitzing top level bridge on BBO lately, and even the best players are not even close to 100% on these kind of plays. I am reminded of what Bob Hamman once wrote across his (then) brand new copy of Larry Cohen's book To Bid or Not to Bid: "BID".
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#19 User is offline   PhilKing 

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Posted 2012-November-30, 15:32

 jdeegan, on 2012-November-30, 14:54, said:

:P This hand and thread illustrates an excellent point that even very good players sometimes overlook. Finding a winning defense is often far from a sure thing. On this hand the defense has two chances (1) Ace and a spade at trick one (not very damn likely in an honest game). (2) Ace and a spade at trick three.

I have been kibitzing top level bridge on BBO lately, and even the best players are not even close to 100% on these kind of plays. I am reminded of what Bob Hamman once wrote across his (then) brand new copy of Larry Cohen's book To Bid or Not to Bid: "BID".


Fortunately there is a third chance. Partner switches to a club, we notice we have a singleton spade and switch to it.
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#20 User is offline   steve2005 

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Posted 2012-December-02, 11:00

 JLOGIC, on 2012-October-24, 22:28, said:

Easy pass to me, I have a stiff spade and clubs locked up. Would not even think about bidding for >1 second

yes how can you think of anything but pass with such great clubs, opp not running away with it
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