[RunemPard]

North is dealt...
♠: AT63
♥: J
♦: KQJT64
♣: A7

South is dealt...
♠: 94
♥: AQ4
♦: A98
♣: KJT62

North is 2nd to bid after a pass.

How would you and your partner bid this hand? Would you be interested in a slam based on your pairs bidding? Which systems handle these minor suit slams best without interfering with a possible 3NT game?

Another thing worth mentioning I suppose would be your thoughts playing MP and IMP.

[Cyberyeti]

For us:

1♦(4+ cards)-2♣(10+)
2♠(GF but not necessarily enormous, at least 5♦/4♠)-3♦
3♥-4♣
4♥(Keycard)-5♣(2 without Q)
5N(general grand try, in this case as could ask about anything else, are your clubs running opposite the ace)-6♦(no)

[mike777]

1d(3+)=2c(14+)
2d(6)=3d
4h(rkc in d)=5c(2 deny Q)
5h(sp k ask, grand try, deny KS)=6c(kc deny kh and ks)
6d

[TWO4BRIDGE]

RunemPard, on 2012-May-22, 16:30, said:

North is dealt...
♠: AT63
♥: J
♦: KQJT64
♣: A7

South is dealt...
♠: 94
♥: AQ4
♦: A98
♣: KJT62

With the 1D - 2C! auction, the first priority is to investigate a 4-4 major fit:

North
1D - 2C! ( 2/1 GF; does not deny a 4 card Major )
2S ( 4 cards ♠ ) - 2NT ( no 4 card Major, but have Ht stop[s] )
3D ( extra length ) - ??

Since North has shown only 3 cards in ♣ & ♥, South may well go past 3NT with 4D ;
Now 4H! by North would be kickback ( when agreement is first made at the 4-level ).

-- OR -- if using Zelandakh's method ( bottom of post # 8 ) , 4H! would be Negative [ EDIT: Decline slam try ] but the next 4 steps would be Positive [ EDIT: Accept slam try ] and "show" key cards.

In either case, since ALL key cards are found along with the ♦ Q , 6D would be reached when there is only ONE outside K .

With Zel's method, after a ♦Q-ask, North would show it w/o any outside K .

This post has been edited by TWO4BRIDGE: 2012-May-23, 07:50

[aguahombre]

Our sequence would bog down at 3NT by South. It's a decent slam, even with them getting trumps on the table at trick one; but, it just didn't happen this time.

[Codo]

1 ♦ 2 ♣
2♦ 3 ♦
3♠ 3 NT

I haved missed even better slams before...

If responder has interesst in higher goals, he may bid 4 ♣ instead of 3 NT and reach the great slam. But I would not do this at mps, maybe not even at imps.

[mike777]

agree this is a somewhat border line hand but



I need to show more than some crappy ten pt opener


2d by me could be so weakish.

it helps if 2c is not crap.

[Zelandakh]

My auction:-

1♦ = 10-17, 4+ diamonds, unbal
... - 1♥ = INV+ relay
1NT = 4+ spades
... - 2♣ = GF relay
2♠ = max, 4 spades, 6+ diamonds
... - 2NT = relay
3♣ = 6 diamonds, 0-1 hearts
... - 3♦ = relay
4♣ = 4162, 5 controls
... - 4♦ = relay
5♣ = diamond, spade and club controls, no heart ace
... - 5♦ = relay
5♠ = at least 2 of top 3 diamonds, only 1 of top 3 spades
... = 6♦ (not enough space to check for the ♣Q)

Of course South could be very pessimistic after 3♣ and just sign off in 3NT. However, the heart shortage, diamond length and extras seem to give good slam possibilities so continuing relays looks to be the best option. Unfortunately I am one step too high to safely check for the ♣Q. Note also that I think going past 3NT with the South hand without having first found out about the heart shortage is very brave/foolhardy* in Commentator-speak.

* delete as applicable according to what works for the given hand.

In practise I would expect lots of pairs in 3NT on this hand, probably most going with auctions along the lines of Roland or Don. Don's note about my 4m convention is that where 4m is bid in a way that sets the trump suit and slam is in the air, the first step declines a slam try and higher bids accept the slam try and show key cards at the same time. So after South bids 4♦, North's possibilities are

4♥ = decline slam try
4♠ = accept slam try, 1 or 4 key cards
4NT = accept slam try, 0 or 3 key cards
5♣ = accept slam try, 2 or 5 key cards, no ♦Q
5♦ = accept slam try, 2 or 5 key cards, with ♦Q

In this case the bid is 4NT over which South asks for the ♦Q with 5♣ and North bids 6♦ to show the queen with nothing exra.

The idea of this convention is to be a compromise between 4m being a slam try with cue bids to follow and 4m being Minorwood. You get to make a slam try and a key card answer at Kickback levels at the cost of being able to make 4 level cues.

[RunemPard]

I got this hand with a random partner...we had bid it...

1D-2C
2D-2H
2S-3D (I preferred having North play NT)
ALL PASS

This hand seemed nearly impossible for SAYC or 2/1 to find a slam without being very optimistic. Too much room had been taken away to show shape, points, and NT supports to safely investigate slam.

I am not a Precision player, but was curious how the basic BBO system would handle this hand?

[Codo]

A prec. player would open 1 ♦ and partner will bid 3 NT after he found out about the spade stopper. He may not even know that there is a big diamond fit...

To pass 3 ♦ is ridicolous. 2 Club/ 2 Heart / 3 Diamond is simply forcing.

I doubt that it was a good idea to let north play. You have two finesses in side suits, he will have at most one in spades.

[EricK]

You seem to have a lot of room playing a natural system:
1♦ 2♣
2♠ 2NT (2♠ is GF so can afford to just show nature of hand at cheapest level)
3♦ 3♥ (3♦ extra length, 3♥ cuebid showing ♦ support and ♥A)
now with a hand more suitable for NT, North can sign off in 3N. But with solid ♦ and plenty of controls controls, North should continue cue bidding. At pairs, you should be playing a system which allows you to eventually sign off in 4NT if necessary on these minor suit, borderline slam hands.

[phil_20686]

Whenever south shows his diamond support, it always implies a suitable hand to play in 5 minor. The north hand is massive in trick taking potential opposite a club suit, so there should be no problem getting to slam.

think
1d-2c
2s-3d
4c

is perfectly ok. It feels like a lot of posters here are undervaluing the trick taking potential of the north hand. As little as a hand like Kx xxxx Axx Kxxx is already cold for slam.

[mikl_plkcc]

In my system:
N-S
1♦ (natural) - 2♣ (natural invitational+)
3♦ (indicating medium hand and 6+ ♦s) - 5♦ (sign off in a game)

If North's rebid is a reverse but not 3♦, the result is also the same:
N-S
1♦ (natural) - 2♣ (natural invitational+)
2♠* (reverse, GF over a 2/1 response) - 2NT
3♦ - 5♦

Responder can count 15-17 (a medium hand) + 14 = 29-31 points, not enough for a slam.

* I treat this as a reverse since responder would have responded 1♠ with 6+ and 4+ ♠s if without a 5-card suit.