[gwnn]

You should bid 7♠ over 5NT if you are going to bid 7♠ no matter what. If you don't, there's a significant chance director will roll it back to 6+1.

[aguahombre]

finding both the king and jack of diamonds onside ---or opening lead of club ace and the diamond king onside ----is a bit more than "got lucky".

No rollback. The opps were just plain fixed.

[gwnn]

I'm not sure I agree but even if you were right, I am not talking about the director's duties, but the player's. Normally if you know that you are going to bid 7 no matter what, do it over 5NT, not over his 6 level signoff. If you don't know for sure, think about it over 5NT.

[peachy]

Hanoi5, on Aug 9 2010, 03:08 AM, said:

Isn't that the idea of having a catch-all? Here's a hand where you can't be sure of the right denomination so you just temporarily bid 2♠, waiting for partner to clear out what he has,

The idea of catchall covers situations where opener doesn't have a more descriptive bid available. In my preferred methods, a completely descriptive bid was available so it would have been wrong to resort to the catchall and at the same time deny the exact hand that opener had (6+ good suit and 15+ or equivalent slight extras). The only objection to not using the systemic 3S call might be that opener not only had slight extras, but *significant* extras.

I am not forcing my system upon you, but what does opener's rebid of 3S mean in your methods? Or for others, who would have rebid 2S with the given hand?

[Codo]

I understand your idea Peachy, but the problem is that it is too difficult to reach 6 ♦ after a 3 ♠ rebid. Make your hand 6313 or so and many would agree with your choice.

I had choose the rout via 1 ♠ 2 ♦ 2 ♠ 3 ♣ 3 ♦ 3 ♠ too, but I had still been unsure about strain and sttrength despite 3 rounds of bidding.

[aguahombre]

peachy, on Aug 9 2010, 02:57 PM, said:

I am not forcing my system upon you, but what does opener's rebid of 3S mean in your methods?  Or for others, who would have rebid 2S with the given hand?

Nor would I presume to force my style on you. But, to answer the question: there are some 2/1 pairs who believe that jumps in 2/1 auctions, where game is already forced, should paint a fairly narrow-range picture ---in hopes that partner will assume captaincy.

For us a jump rebid of the major after 2/1 shows a solid suit, with at-most, one outside prime. Other hands, such as the one in the OP can take it more slowly in hopes that responder might be able to describe her hand better than we can.

Again, this is just answering your question. If you feel that jumping in 2/1 auctions with a wider variety of hands is worth the space consumation, and have the follow-ups to handle it ---that is fine, too.

[peachy]

aguahombre, on Aug 10 2010, 11:41 AM, said:

For us a jump rebid of the major after 2/1 shows a solid suit, with at-most, one outside prime.

What is your agreement for uncontested
1S-2D -3NT?

I am merely trying to get a picture of what "mainstream" agreement is. For me, 3NT shows solid 6 carder.

[aguahombre]

peachy, on Aug 10 2010, 02:40 PM, said:

aguahombre, on Aug 10 2010, 11:41 AM, said:

For us a jump rebid of the major after 2/1 shows a solid suit, with at-most, one outside prime.

What is your agreement for uncontested
1S-2D -3NT?

I am merely trying to get a picture of what "mainstream" agreement is. For me, 3NT shows solid 6 carder.

18-19 bal..5-3-3-2....2-card support for responder's suit. Again, a picture so that responder can be in control. Not sure I would want to be the declarer in NT if the jump to 3NT was used as a solid M.

Of course we couldn't do that if we couldn't open 1NT with 5M and 15-17, and if we couldn't raise responder with a 3 card fit; so it isn't workable for everyone.

That might not be "mainstream". But it is "Old Hardy". I know what a lot of others do differently, but I don't know "mainstream"; and it makes for smooth auctions when a picture can be painted ---and slower give-and-take auctions when the hands don't fit a particular mold.

[peachy]

aguahombre, on Aug 10 2010, 06:26 PM, said:

peachy, on Aug 10 2010, 02:40 PM, said:

aguahombre, on Aug 10 2010, 11:41 AM, said:

For us a jump rebid of the major after 2/1 shows a solid suit, with at-most, one outside prime.

What is your agreement for uncontested
1S-2D -3NT?

I am merely trying to get a picture of what "mainstream" agreement is. For me, 3NT shows solid 6 carder.

18-19 bal..5-3-3-2....2-card support for responder's suit. Again, a picture so that responder can be in control. Not sure I would want to be the declarer in NT if the jump to 3NT was used as a solid M.

Of course we couldn't do that if we couldn't open 1NT with 5M and 15-17, and if we couldn't raise responder with a 3 card fit; so it isn't workable for everyone.

That might not be "mainstream". But it is "Old Hardy". I know what a lot of others do differently, but I don't know "mainstream"; and it makes for smooth auctions when a picture can be painted ---and slower give-and-take auctions when the hands don't fit a particular mold.

Well. in my methods 1S-2D-2NT is either 18-19 or minimum, with 15-17 rebid 3NT. Now that is "new Hardy" [I can give referense if needed]. I have no idea what "old Hardy" is. IMO, jump to 3NT with 18-19 is detrimental to constructive bidding because it takes so much space and leaves responder poorly equipped to decide a) level and B ) strain, if he has 3-card spade support. Just shows that nobody knows what "mainstream" is.

[aguahombre]

I understand and appreciate your take on the various rebids, Peach. (I also enjoy your Vugraph commentaries, when you can get a word in edgewise.)

Was just answering your questions from another perspective. When I say "Old Hardy", it probably is not entirely accurate. This, and many other sequences from his first two books were hashed over and over by a lot of West Coast players way back then. They filled in holes with agreements which my partner and I still use.

I noticed that Jill Meyers and Ed Davis (Vugraph of NAOP) still employ a lot of those old concepts.

[Fluffy]

I would play this hand in diamonds, not able to locate ♠Q in time, I prefer to ruff my third round spade in dummy if neccesary.