[G_R__E_G]

My regular partner and I have some specific sequences where we use 3nt as RKCB. Should this be alerted, or should it be divulged at the end of the auction? I'm of the understanding that at certain times one or the other of these two actions is required with bids like this but I'm not sure what the criteria are for each. Thanks.

[Al_U_Card]

Seems to me that any ace asking bid is NOT alertable but must be explained as such at the end of the auction.

[Free]

Al_U_Card, on Oct 13 2005, 05:18 PM, said:

Seems to me that any ace asking bid is NOT alertable but must be explained as such at the end of the auction.

huh??? 3NT is an artificial bid, so why shouldn't it be alerted?? I never heard that Ace asking bids aren't alertable Perhaps this is a local rule?

[pigpenz]

I thought on the ACBL chart bids that are ace asking at the fourlevel need not be alerted so things like super key card gerber etc need not be alerted....now 3nt I am not sure but if the understand is that it is a form of a forcing strong raise then it should be alerted. So there really isnt anything wrong with alerting it, eliminates any problems.

[hotShot]

Usually ace asking bids are above 3NT, in f2f bridge without screens alerting slam bidding sequences is more help to partner than to opps. Many local organisations regulate that artificial bids above 3 NT should not be alerted.

You 3NT bid should be alerted.

[Al_U_Card]

Darn! I keep forgetting that 3NT is below the 4 level (helps to explain some of my results tho... )

Right you are, of course.

[mycroft]

The answer to any "is this Alertable" question is "Depends on where you are."
Alert regulations differ from Sponsoring Organization to Sponsoring Organization, with changes depending on screen/online use among others.

In FtF play in the ACBL, the Alert chart says that 4NT (any form over suit bid) or 4C (any form over NT) are not Alertable, though you should explain that you have had an ace-asking auction after the auction (after the opening lead if defending). All other ace-asking auctions are Alertable, although some are delayed Alerts (for example, 1H-4S kickback is directly Alertable, as it's before opener's rebid).

In England, it's different; in Australia, different again; in the final of the Spingold, it's different again (because of the screen).

So - where are you from?
Michael.

[G_R__E_G]

Quote

The answer to any "is this Alertable" question is "Depends on where you are."

Sorry. Ontario, Canada.

[mr1303]

Does this "no alerts above 3NT" apply to competitive auctions as well?

[Free]

mr1303, on Oct 13 2005, 11:41 PM, said:

Does this "no alerts above 3NT" apply to competitive auctions as well?

In Belgium we also have this rule "you're not allowed to alert any bid above 3NT" when playing without screens. This has nothing to do with the entire auction (competitive or not), only the bids 4♣, 4♦,...,7NT. Passes with special meanings should be alerted. We're also not allowed to alert any double, but that's another rule.

[pclayton]

No alerts above 3N begin with Opener's 2nd call.

So 1♠ - 4♣ (splinter) is an alert but..:

1♠ - 2♦ - 4♣ (splinter) is NOT an alert.

I guess the idea is that alerts after both opponents have passed that would occur at a high level of bidding seem to help the side bidding more than the defending side.

[mycroft]

Ok, Greg, since you are in ACBL-land, I'll pull the quotes. This, and way too much other information is at http://www.acbl.org/...procedures.html , the Big Alert Chart.

An Alertable 3NT is never delayed - Delayed Alerts are only for calls above 3NT.

Now for the fun part:
"3) ACE ASKING BIDS

4NT Blackwood (any variety over suits) and 4 Gerber (any variety over notrump) and expected responses thereto do not require an Alert of any kind. All other ace-asking bids and responses require an Alert, but some of these Alerts must be "delayed."

Ace-asking bids at the level of 3NT or below and usages on the first round (other than Blackwood and Gerber as described above), require an immediate Alert. Unusual ace-asking bids above the level of 3NT starting with opener's second turn to call require a delayed Alert."

So, as you would expect, Baby RKC is Alertable, and not only that, immediately Alertable (however, in rather an unfortunate turn of events, the responses are Delayed Alerts, unless it's 3NT opener RKC).

So, for example:
1S-3D (immediate Alert, splinter, limit raise or huge);
3S (minimum)-3NT! (immediate Alert, I've got the monster, KC please)
4D (0 or 3, don't Alert now!) - (X) - 6S

After the auction, before the opening lead, Alert and explain 4D (if you haven't already, which is unlikely).

However, if after 6S, the nasty opponents sacrifice in 7D, then make the opening lead into 7Dx face down, then Alert (and if asked, explain) 4D, and *then* face the lead.

And yes, PC, the reasoning behind it is that it is believed that in general those Alerts are significantly more likely to help the partnership keep on the rails than help the opponents. It's pretty obvious that when my auction goes

1C!-1H!; 1S!-2D!; 2S!-3H!; 4D-4S; 5C-5S ...

it would almost certainly help for me to know that partner still knows I'm asking, and has replied appropriately instead of just bailing (which information, of course, I couldn't use even if it was Alerted). There are situations, however, where this policy ups and bites the opposing side badly. In other words, there's no perfect solution.

Michael.

This post has been edited by mycroft: 2005-October-14, 12:20