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Appalling penalty double

#1 User is offline   asbell 

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Posted Yesterday, 15:22

What on earth is this penalty double of 3NT on a scattered 5 HCP about? Even if it expects a fifth diamond from me, there is no reason at all to be making a double with this rubbish. Is it some bizarre simulation outcome?

And why does no-one at BBO seemingly care about fixing this sort of appalling bidding? Captive market, I guess.


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#2 User is offline   johnu 

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Posted Yesterday, 20:43

Solid double, no overtricks. Unfortunate that E/W had their bids.
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#3 User is offline   steve2005 

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Posted Today, 10:39

your lucky opps didnt redouble 2
Sarcasm is a state of mind
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#4 User is offline   mycroft 

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Posted Today, 11:54


I agree. It's totally unreasonable to think that 3NT will only go down one more than 2.

Yes, your opponents made the wrong guess. And your partner failed to let them guess wrong. And that turned an average -400 into a near-bottom -550 (that could have been a clear bottom -760 or -960, or -800 or more, of course). But your partner believed you - that your diamonds were such that on the requested diamond lead, 3NT or 4 would score worse than without it, and that they were such that *if they sat for 2, you expected to set it*. And if you have that hand, since:
  • hearts probably don't run;
  • North has a probable club entry; and
  • not only can North make that requested diamond lead, and there's a good chance she'll be able to do it again;
yeah, it probably does go down on that "scattered 5 count".

And don't you want partner to believe you?

I do agree with you that it's a hopeless double of 3NT; but only because I know there are many many more bridge players who will double here with 2 making (overtricks) then who have been burned by it and have stopped doubling with these "suits".

But ignoring "ATB" for a minute - what are you hoping to accomplish with that double?

Even if you hit non-penalty-seekers like me, you still give us the opportunity to differentiate between 2-, 3-, and 4-card heart support (which might get us to a 4 game that "doesn't have the points"). But many *can* send it back. Even if they don't, there are only two reasons to double 2, and:
  • you don't really want partner to lead a diamond "even if she has to find one from another board", even over a natural lead from their good suit;
  • and you don't really want partner to sacrifice in 5 over 4 when opener has 4 hearts and two diamonds instead (do you?).


P.S. We have a policy of not using others' nicks on the forums without their permission. I haven't edited your OP to remove them, because in this case, it's clear there's no intent (or accidental ability) to shame or bully them (and it's important to know they were humans and not robots). I have removed them in my reply, as you see.
"Which is harder to find - a paranormal field agent, or someone competent who likes talking on the phone?"
"...You may return to your desk." "Thank you." -- Serena vs. Mr. Arthur, "Paranormal Helpline", EGS:NP
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