What's your Brexit end-goal?
#1
Posted 2019-June-30, 07:06
#2
Posted 2019-June-30, 09:40
#3
Posted 2019-June-30, 11:18
There are plenty of European workers already both north and south of the border, and Ireland is as multicultural a country now as many parts of the UK. (I visited Eire recently and was surprised how many Europeans lived there.)
Obviously there will be dissenting voices in the Protestant community about such a merger, but having a border which still foments some ill-feeling between communities is not the way forward, I feel. Irish people are Irish whether they come from Eire or Northern Ireland, and its about time they put aside their religious differences and moved forward.
Many British people I know visit Eire, especially Dublin, and say it's a wonderful place to go to. The Irish people always treated me with warmth and genuine hospitality.
#4
Posted 2019-June-30, 11:27
FelicityR, on 2019-June-30, 11:18, said:
There is a material difference between pragmatic solutions and politically palatable solutions. I might agree with your analysis that NI and RoI can be treated as one contiguous country, still part of the EU. However, it is impossible for our politicians to even contemplate such a solution in the next few parliaments, let alone the present one with the wafer thin majority.
#5
Posted 2019-June-30, 13:15
shyams, on 2019-June-30, 11:27, said:
Impossible for a CONSERVATIVE government to contemplate.
#6
Posted 2019-July-10, 11:36
Equally, I would be delighted if we became GB instead of UK, and that is much simpler, but I don't see it happening. No state just gives territory away. Perhaps the EU could make us an offer?
#7
Posted 2019-July-10, 14:01
fromageGB, on 2019-July-10, 11:36, said:
There can be.
However, not if that border runs between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland
#8
Posted 2019-July-13, 12:58
FelicityR, on 2019-June-30, 11:18, said:
There are plenty of European workers already both north and south of the border, and Ireland is as multicultural a country now as many parts of the UK. (I visited Eire recently and was surprised how many Europeans lived there.)
I know what you mean but actually everyone who lives in Ireland is European :-)
Quote
Many British people I know visit Eire, especially Dublin, and say it's a wonderful place to go to. The Irish people always treated me with warmth and genuine hospitality.
What about Scotland? They are even more pro remain than Northern Ireland.
My crystal ball says 31.10. some kind of Brexit, then Scotland and Northern Irland rebel and soon UK will have the choice between falling apart and reapplying for EU membership.
I like every part of the Divided Kingdom of Britain and Northern Ireland and I simply feel sorry for my friends there, whatever the outcome of Brexit.
#9
Posted 2019-July-14, 10:40
(I'd let N.I. go and keep Scotland )
#10
Posted 2019-July-17, 06:58
Now, can someone explain to me the conservative government's position on this? All Tory leadership candidates seem to be against a customs union; the EU won't accept a customs border between Ireland and NI; and in the backstop negotiations, the government essentially decided to prefer a customs union (I know it's quite a bit more complicated, but too large extent that is what it is) over a customs border between NI and Great Britain.
Is the goal to eventually accede to a customs border between NI and GB, but not say so explicitly as long as possible, only after the process has moved far enough that those opposed to it can no longer stop Brexit?
#11
Posted 2019-July-17, 08:04
#12
Posted 2019-July-17, 11:09
The EU have not really said it won't accept a customs border, as I have read that Eire is planning controls on the border if plan B materialises. Surely the EU will not want an open border?
#13
Posted 2019-July-17, 12:02
#14
Posted 2019-July-18, 05:30
cherdano, on 2019-July-17, 06:58, said:
https://www.theguard...b2C4U2TPEQMGwo8
When you have feelings like this around, and a customs border between NI/GB is seen as the first step to a united Ireland, it's going to be messy.
#15
Posted 2019-August-02, 15:03
It seems obvious that Brexit would make reunification (of Republic of Ireland with NI) more likely.
Yet Sinn Fein opposes Brexit. And the DUP supports Brexit. At least there is a logic to Sinn Fein's position, but apparently the DUP is still under the illusion that NI can be treated identically to the rest of the UK in the post-Brexit UK-EU relations.
Who is deluded here, is it me or the DUP?
#16
Posted 2019-August-02, 17:43
cherdano, on 2019-August-02, 15:03, said:
It seems obvious that Brexit would make reunification (of Republic of Ireland with NI) more likely.
Yet Sinn Fein opposes Brexit. And the DUP supports Brexit. At least there is a logic to Sinn Fein's position, but apparently the DUP is still under the illusion that NI can be treated identically to the rest of the UK in the post-Brexit UK-EU relations.
Who is deluded here, is it me or the DUP?
The DUP are less than sane, they want incompatible things. Biggest failing among Theresa May's many huge failures is not getting the DUP in a room early in the process and asking them to spell out what they actually want, then pointing out that's impossible and why, and asking them what they want MOST.
#17
Posted 2019-August-04, 06:01
Where is the "illusion" that NI is part of the UK? Again, that seems like a fact to me. Apart from minor controls released to peripheral regional assemblies, it will be governed by UK laws and UK trade agreements, have the same social services and health arrangements.
Longer term things will change. Initially the UK will be taking exports from Ireland duty free, but if the UE does not reciprocate and starts taxing ours, then we should and probably will follow suit. Maybe Ireland would leave the EU and have its own Eirexit so it can make its own trade arrangements.
#18
Posted 2019-October-11, 16:09
#19
Posted 2019-October-16, 07:24
#20
Posted 2019-October-16, 11:37
Zelandakh, on 2019-October-16, 07:24, said:
Yes but the arithmetic has changed, DUP less important than getting some labour and ex-tories on side. Also is a dose of realism, there are other bits of the May deal that look like they're biting the dust. I think this is a realisation by the government that they need a deal if they want Brexit to happen, the May deal is not Brexit in any recognizable form, so compromise is needed.