[mike777]

MP, both nv

1h=p=?

Pard opens 1h, your call with:

J63...AT853...8754...A

[PhantomSac]

What is your major suit structure?

Otherwise the answers you get will be "Obv I bid 3S showing a mini splinter somewhere" or "obv I bid 2N limit+" or "Obv I bid 3N which shows a good 1-4, promising at least one ace outside" or "I would bid 3D bergen which I play can include a light splinter that plans on bidding game, partner can ask with 3S."

Usually I hate answers like that but the answer to this seems purely based on what system you play.

[mike777]

Thanks Justin.


I could not find a good call with what I play(Kimmel/Hugh style) so I throw it out there.
Full Bergen raises and style, splinters showing around a 7 loser hand, can later show stiff or void.

This is from BW where the bidding started with strong club systems and looking at both hands I doubted I could stop low enough in time when opener has a big hand playing 2/1. I did not want to bias the first response.

[whereagles]

Some kind of strong GF raise, for sure.

[broze]

I am bidding game via 2N or whatever. The one thing I don't do is splinter - I like to have the agreement not to do that here with a stiff Ace.

[mike777]

thanks for responses...as I said my issue was how to stop short when pard has a big/huge hand....I could not.


Bathhurst ended up in 5h.

very young players stopped in 4h

all after strong club.

[manudude03]

If playing a strong club, you should probably just bid 4H here. If not, I think I'm just making a limit raise with the proviso that partner very rarely passes it.

[mr1303]

4H is automatic in precision.

I'd bid 2NT otherwise if playing something vaguely standard, and then sign off lots unless pard showed a stiff diamond.

[Fluffy]

I normally bid 1NT + 4♥ with hands in the 8-10 range that can't stand playing partscore.

[the_clown]

I like to play 2N as invit+ with 4 card support which wouls work great here. Not having that I am endplayed into Jaccoby 2N, but I dont like it.

[whereagles]

Why not? J2NT is GF anyway. How can it be worse than 2NT as inv+? I don't get it

[gszes]

manudude03, on 2015-January-18, 23:26, said:

If playing a strong club, you should probably just bid 4H here. If not, I think I'm just making a limit raise with the proviso that partner very rarely passes it.

Even if you happen to be right that the hand does not make 4h (and it is purely guesswork) it makes it
easier for the opps to compete when p has a hand that was going to pass 3h. Not a good thing
when they may easily make something under those conditions (at least one if not both opps is VERY short
in hearts). Trying to hit such a small target this way is actually throwing away part of the advantage
of bidding first (especially for light openers).

[FrancesHinden]

This is a hand where I'd make a Bergen limit raise then bid game over the sign-off. I want to force to game, but I don't want to mislead partner about my high cards.
(our system file says this sequence 'often has a singleton A or K' )

[Free]

I hate splintering with a stiff Ace, so I'll start with a forcing mixed raise (like Bergen raise if available) and raise to game if partner signs off at 3-level.

I'm unfamiliar with Kimmel/Hugh style, can you elaborate?

[mike777]

Free, on 2015-January-25, 03:46, said:

I hate splintering with a stiff Ace, so I'll start with a forcing mixed raise (like Bergen raise if available) and raise to game if partner signs off at 3-level.

I'm unfamiliar with Kimmel/Hugh style, can you elaborate?

thanks, mainly 2/1 Marty Bergen style for the most part.

On this deal the problem I had was I did not think I could stop below slam if I show limit or better playing a 2/1 style. Pard has very big hand. IN the BW problem both players were playing a strong club and opened a big club, one stopped in 4h the other in 5h.

I did not want to bias the discussion by showing both hands but thanks to all.

[rhm]

mr1303, on 2015-January-19, 05:07, said:

4H is automatic in precision.

What do you open with ♠Axx ♥Kxxxxx ♦- ♣KQxx playing precision?

This may not be a likely hand, but it is a possible hand and it makes 7♥ lay-down.

Rainer Herrmann

[rhm]

Free, on 2015-January-25, 03:46, said:

I hate splintering with a stiff Ace, so I'll start with a forcing mixed raise (like Bergen raise if available) and raise to game if partner signs off at 3-level.

Splintering with a stiff ace is a problem when you have full values for a splinter. Partner may sign off with useful values in the splinter suit.
When you have minimal values for a splinter this problem is much diminished if it exist at all.

Any other way of showing a hand which is interested in more than game will give partner even less clue when to continue.

For example here and similar for 2NT (Jacoby or inv.+ raises):

You start with a forcing mixed Bergen raise.
How will opener ever know - assuming he does not have a rock crusher in HCP - when to continue beyond game and when to stop unless you somehow reveal your side suit distribution escapes me.

If opener does not know you are better off raising straight to game. This at least leaves opponents in the dark about your hand as well.

Rainer Herrmann

[FrancesHinden]

rhm, on 2015-January-28, 03:45, said:

How will opener ever know - assuming he does not have a rock crusher in HCP - when to continue beyond game and when to stop unless you somehow reveal your side suit distribution escapes me.

If opener does not know you are better off raising straight to game. This at least leaves opponents in the dark about your hand as well.

The idea is that you show partner your high card strength (roughly). If he has a hand which can make slam opposite those high cards, he can show his shortage and you have a good idea what to do.

[mike777]

FrancesHinden, on 2015-January-31, 01:34, said:

The idea is that you show partner your high card strength (roughly). If he has a hand which can make slam opposite those high cards, he can show his shortage and you have a good idea what to do.

thank You for your responses Frances this time BW gives us:

AK5...KQJ72...KQJ9...3

perhaps a mixed raise( 9 loser hand keeps us out of slam)?

[FrancesHinden]

mike777, on 2015-January-31, 20:36, said:

thank You for your responses Frances this time BW gives us:

AK5...KQJ72...KQJ9...3

perhaps a mixed raise( 9 loser hand keeps us out of slam)?

I'd make a limit raise, not a mixed raise. Partner shows a slam try with club shortage, and I sign off. We may still get to the 5-level, which isn't safe.