[dickiegera]

When playing inverted minors what is best, off or on over overcalls, off or on over double.

Thank you

[aguahombre]

I wouldn't say what is best, but after an overcall...if you use 2m as inverted...you can bid 2m with a stop in their suit and cue with the invitational + raise and no stopper.

Over a Double, we find that we need 2m to show a mama-papa 4-card raise of the minor. We have Jordan 2NT with 5-card limit raises available, and redouble of 1C to show a balanced 4-card invite hand.

[Mbodell]

I think off in both cases makes the most sense. With an overcall you have otherways to show good hands (cue), and a simple raise can be very useful in case it becomes a part score battle (quite likely). With a double you have both XX as well as 2nt and simple and double raise. You can figure out how you want to arrange your calls, but again I think a simple raise is useful and either 2nt as limit or 3m as limit with 2nt as flip-flop is pretty reasonable.

[whereagles]

Inverted minors can be useful for slam bidding, which is much less likely after an overcall/dbl.

So yes, you can probably do without them in that case.

[SteveMoe]

Given the other tools an overcall or a double introduce (mentioned by the above posters), there's little to gain by keeping Inverted Raises on in either case. Why introduce another exception to the tool kit for competitive auctions? Keeping it simple here seems just fine.

I like agua's idea about w & w/o stopper, but I'm not sure the reward is that great.

[Cyberyeti]

dickiegera, on 2014-August-09, 21:59, said:

When playing inverted minors what is best, off or on over overcalls, off or on over double.

Thank you

Also depends if your IM is GF or not, we do keep them on in both cases, but ours are not GF, I think there's much less of a case for keeping them on opposite a short club and if they're GF.

[yunling]

Sometimes you really need to have 2m as a 4 card weak raise in competition, e.g.
♠ XXX
♥ QX
♦ KXXX
♣ KJXX
1D-(1S)-?

Cuebid or Jordan 2NT is usually ok for inv+ hands.

[whereagles]

You can bid 1NT on that, but yeah probably 2♦ is preferable.

[helene_t]

SteveMoe, on 2014-August-10, 12:15, said:

Given the other tools an overcall or a double introduce (mentioned by the above posters), there's little to gain by keeping Inverted Raises on in either case.

That's the point.

Something else: if you play inverted minors and you are dealt a hand with which you fear that 3m isn't lawfull, you can just bid 1NT in the uncontested auction. After an overcall you can't always do that as you need a stopper in opp's suit. So you need the non-forcing single raise.