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Forcing Pass? and how obvious?

Poll: Forcing Pass? (20 member(s) have cast votes)

Is pass forcing in this auction?

  1. Yes, for every (reasonable) pair (2 votes [10.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.00%

  2. Yes, but some pairs might think not (2 votes [10.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 10.00%

  3. No, but some pairs might think so (7 votes [35.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 35.00%

  4. No, not for any (reasonable) pair (9 votes [45.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 45.00%

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#21 User is offline   awm 

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Posted 2011-May-05, 09:59

Here's the rest of the story regarding this hand...

This took place in a local sectional tournament. My wife (the 4 bidder) was playing with a student in the B/C/D pairs. There was a very noticeable break in tempo by opener prior to his pass over 4, and responder balanced 5. The director was called to the table prior to the end of the auction.

The director was annoyed to have been called, stating that it was very obvious that this is a forcing pass auction and so defending 4 was never a LA. He indicated that he would never make a ruling on this board regardless of the contents of the players hands, and made derogatory comments about my wife's bridge knowledge.

We thought this was uncalled for and are filing a recorder form about the director (much good may it do; this guy directs almost all local events and we have complained about him on many prior occasions). While the director's rudeness was obviously a problem, I was curious whether his opinion that this was "obviously a forcing pass situation" would be held by a sizable proportion of bridge players. This poll seems to indicate what I would've assumed... not really.

The result on the board was not really at issue; it turns out that opener had about the most obvious double of 4 imaginable (AKxx KJ9 Jxx xxx) and both 4 and 5 were failing.
Adam W. Meyerson
a.k.a. Appeal Without Merit
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#22 User is offline   jillybean 

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Posted 2011-May-05, 10:00

 Phil, on 2011-May-05, 09:25, said:

I would never take this pass as forcing. I'm surprised the OP would even post this.

@Jilly re: Neil Kimelman's rules - its reasonable to play a FP when one hand invites, and we are vulnerable, however, here opener has signed off, and both partners have bid the limit of their hand, so why do we have to choose between 4x'd and 5?

Good question and I am following this thread closely. We have only agreed on FP rules in the past few days and have a lot of fine tuning to do.
"And no matter what methods you play, it is essential, for anyone aspiring to learn to be a good player, to learn the importance of bidding shape properly." MikeH
(still learning)
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#23 User is offline   Phil 

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Posted 2011-May-05, 10:45

 awm, on 2011-May-05, 09:59, said:

We thought this was uncalled for and are filing a recorder form about the director (much good may it do; this guy directs almost all local events and we have complained about him on many prior occasions).


Adam, if you want to send me a PM about who this is, please do so. I have a few ideas.

File a recorder form if you wish, but this won't accomplish anything. This is a disciplinary matter and needs to be brought to the attention of the Unit and the District; maybe at a national level.
Hi y'all!

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#24 User is offline   jdeegan 

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Posted 2011-May-07, 01:52

:rolleyes: Simple rule all the good players use: if we bid a game to make and they bid on, the pass is forcing. That is not the case here. We stopped at 4. Lot's of tournament directors are not good bridge players themselves.
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