[cloa513]

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East has AJ of clubs (I had that right before)

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By all rights the bidding should have gone something like that with 25 HCP between east-west and a great deal of the intermediaries. Now the play is the difficult thing. Our defence made it easy for declarers but a difficult lead would have been a low heart which is ducked. After play A♣ and J♣ which is ducked (no discard), I thought the best play is a diamond sure you loose a trick but defender now have to guess rather you having commit completely to a strategy. I would assume 4 hearts including the ace in South.

This post has been edited by inquiry: 2010-November-26, 22:22
Reason for edit: added the AJ of clubs to EAST.

[inquiry]

cloa513, on 2010-November-26, 20:42, said:

By all rights the bidding should have gone something like that with 25 HCP between east-west....

I know I have already proven that I can not count, but unless you made another mistake (besides missing the ♣AJ, EW have only 23 (not 25) HCP.

cloa513, on 2010-November-26, 20:42, said:

... and a great deal of the intermediaries. Now the play is the difficult thing. Our defence made it easy for declarers but a difficult lead would have been a low heart which is ducked....... and
After play A♣ and J♣ which is ducked (no discard), I thought the best play is a diamond sure you loose a trick but defender now have to guess rather you having commit completely to a strategy. I would assume 4 hearts including the ace in South.

A low heart "which is ducked" seems to suggest that E-W win the first heart.. What heart was lead? Your statement was you "assume" South had 4♥, was this based on the lead (like fourth best).

It would also be useful to know what bidding system N-S playing. For instance, if they play 12-14 one NT, that would eliminate some possible hands in figuring out how to play. If they play 1♣ as forcing and 1♦ as negative, that could be significant. If 1♣ was not forcing, could it be as short as two? Also, if 1♦ was natural wiht Walsh we almost certainly can place West with 4-4 in the majors (else East would respond a major), further support for your assumption. Since we now know that clubs is no worse than 4-2, west is likely 4-4-2-3 or 4-4-1-4 (can no longer have 5 clubs).

Your going to have to have South have the ♠Ace to have a chance to make. So we have west With four spades to ACE and four hearts to ACE (yes, i know restricted choice would decrease the chance west has the ACE since he lead a heart, but WE NEED the spade ace in his hand.. nuff said.

Next, you try to figure out what North has for his bid. Would he bid with 3 hcp (one queen and one jack). If you think not, then South has to have the diamond ACE or both queens and the jack of spades. Would North bid with Just the ACE? If not the hand is double dummy.... South has something like this. I would assume South wouldn't open with a stiff diamond Queen, but that could be a matter of judgement. We are assuming South would NOT open 1C on two card suit (no alert).:

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So these are the two general hands you should play for....(South could have singleton diamond ACE)

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On the first hand, the play is fairly straight forward following the line you already suggest. After taking AJ of clubs, spade to ACE, and play two more rounds of clubs. Then play on spades (hooking the jack). West can win but be endplayed. If he ducks, just continue with spade king.

On the second hand, you need to decide if North has QTxx or Qxxx of diamonds. East is much more likely to hold the ten so you need to have won the heart jack and attacked diamonds by leading them first. Could be a cool club-diamond fraternizied squeeze on North, I think, in some lines.

Anyway, to follow the line you have given, with cashing AJ of clubs.. here goes...

T1. HK
T2 CA
T3 CJ
T4 SQ
T5 CK <<---when club Queen falls, the spade jack will be right... play is clear.

This post has been edited by inquiry: 2010-November-27, 10:40
Reason for edit: I forgot I was East when I wrote the stuff about the play. I have tried to correct the description of play

[cloa513]

You mean what system N-S was playing. Something like BBO SAYC. I sorry I miscounted the HCP but given the initial bidding you have to put reaching 3NT a good chance.

You have the wrong hand designations- I assume you mean to refer to South not West. North has the lead by the way and given he didn't bid 1H then he has guessed South has 4 hearts and not many diamonds. You would assume by the bidding that respectively North and South have about 6HCP and 11 HCP. You would guess that South has clubs and 1 four card major.

[inquiry]

cloa513, on 2010-November-27, 01:40, said:

You mean what system N-S was playing. Something like BBO SAYC. I sorry I miscounted the HCP but given the initial bidding you have to put reaching 3NT a good chance.

You have the wrong hand designations- I assume you mean to refer to South not West. North has the lead by the way and given he didn't bid 1H then he has guessed South has 4 hearts and not many diamonds. You would assume by the bidding that respectively North and South have about 6HCP and 11 HCP. You would guess that South has clubs and 1 four card major.

I have corrected my description of the hand layout.

I would be leary of guessing south has four clubs and one four card major. The reason being that means North responded 1♦ when holding 4♠ and 4♦. Now a lot of people bid up the line of course, which is why I asked. If you "assume" north needs SIX hcp for his response, then the ♠JACK has to be with opener and North holds one ACE and one Queen (only way to get your assumed 11-6 split).

I think I would stick with my initial assumption of the hcp being divided 12-5 rather than 11-6. But if you are CERTAIN about North having six hcp to respond, then it is best ot play that North would respond 1♦ when holding 4♠ and 4/5 ♦s (we know he is 3♥ and at least 2♣ and no less than 3♠ so 5 ♦ is the most he could have). In fact, if you are going to make it when North holds 6 hcp and the club queen doesn't drop in two rounds, you need an awful lot...

You need clubs to be 3-3
You need south to hold the club Queen because north will need the diamond queen
South needs to hold the spade Ace, and finally,
South must not hold four spades.

Now we have a problem. clubs have to be 3-3, spades 3-4, hearts 4-3. That means that diamonds must be 3-3, so north responded 1♦ with a hand like the following two... would north Really bid 1♦ with these?

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And if North had something like

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You have to win the first heart in dummy and lead a diamond at trick two. So I stay with my initial plan

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[cloa513]

inquiry, on 2010-November-27, 11:31, said:

I have corrected my description of the hand layout.

I would be leary of guessing south has four clubs and one four card major. The reason being that means North responded 1♦ when holding 4♠ and 4♦. Now a lot of people bid up the line of course, which is why I asked. If you "assume" north needs SIX hcp for his response, then the ♠JACK has to be with opener and North holds one ACE and one Queen (only way to get your assumed 11-6 split).

I think I would stick with my initial assumption of the hcp being divided 12-5 rather than 11-6. But if you are CERTAIN about North having six hcp to respond, then it is best ot play that North would respond 1♦ when holding 4♠ and 4/5 ♦s (we know he is 3♥ and at least 2♣ and no less than 3♠ so 5 ♦ is the most he could have). In fact, if you are going to make it when North holds 6 hcp and the club queen doesn't drop in two rounds, you need an awful lot...

You need clubs to be 3-3
You need south to hold the club Queen because north will need the diamond queen
South needs to hold the spade Ace, and finally,
South must not hold four spades.

Now we have a problem. clubs have to be 3-3, spades 3-4, hearts 4-3. That means that diamonds must be 3-3, so north responded 1♦ with a hand like the following two... would north Really bid 1♦ with these?

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And if North had something like

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You have to win the first heart in dummy and lead a diamond at trick two. So I stay with my initial plan

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Good logic but you only need even breaks if you are on lead. Opponents can easily stuff up defence when put on lead.
They have no good options.

North South Hands.

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error QD witrhgNoreth instead of King
In practice North lead a diamond and I choose the hopeless spade return.