[helene_t]

Many tournaments do not specify any rules or just refer to BBO standard rules. In the BBO rules I found nothing specified about Brown Sticker Conventions. May I assume that WBF Brown Sticker regulations apply if nothing else has been specified?

Suppose that the opponents use a Brown Sticker against you (This may all sound hypothetical but it has happened). Suppose you consider that illegal under the tournament. Suppose you have sympathy for your opps and don't want to send an e-mail to "abuse" but would rather give them some friendly advice. ACBL tournament rules prohibits this I think (correct me if I'm wrong). Is this also the case in other tournaments?

[the hog]

Acbl tournaments might ban brown stickers, but be aware that what is brown sticker is literally, (and I am not joking here), played by little old ladies in sat afternoon duplicates here. Other bbo tournaments unless they are mickey mouse, allow anything.

Anyway Helene, you should regard this as an intellectual challenge.

[hrothgar]

This depends completely on the conditions of contest of the event in question.

Most tournaments have attempted to define regulations regarding alerts/announcements.

A small number have adopted some restrictions on conventional bids, normally directed against "Polish" systems.

Paradoxially, the ACBL - which has the most comprehensive set of convention restrictions - doesn't seem to require the use of its equally comprehensive alerting system.

For what its worth - and this certainly isn't directed at Helene - I've found that most playerrs who complain about the use of Brown Sticker Conventions aren't familiar with the actual definition.

[Gerben47]

Check out Chris Ryall's Weak Two Archive for more information on Brown Sticker opening bids.
The likeliest BS you will encounter are:

Wilkosz (2D = 5-5 not both minors)
Major Flash (2H = weak two in either major)

Here's a link to Chris' generic defence page:
http://www.cavendish.demon.co.uk/bridge/we...ric-defence.htm

If you have a regular partner be sure to discuss how to defend the non-Brown Sticker "weak both major" and Multi 2♦ openings as well.

Gerben

"Polish Club is not an evil system!"

[helene_t]

Thanx, apparently everything is allowed and people who don't like that can play in ACBL tournaments. So far I have not found BSC's to be a major problem so it will not influence my choice of tournament.

I tend to agree that Polish Club is not an evil system and that BSC's should be seen as an intelectual challenge. It does depend on your kind of partnership, though. If you sub for someone and have 20 seconds to make agreements on defence against natural methods .... or if you're a beginner who started reading about defence against natural preempts yestereday.

[Free]

Ron: you're TOTALLY wrong! 2NT preempt in either minor, wilkosz, tutti fruti,... are ALL brown sticker.

Gerben, I don't think Major Flash and multi are brown sticker. These are exceptions, since any bid which shows a weak-2 in either major is not considered brown sticker anymore.

In tourneys everything is allowed unless it's specified. Psyching, brown sticker, hums,... are all allowed.

[helene_t]

Free, on Jul 23 2004, 02:05 PM, said:

Gerben, I don't think Major Flash and multi are brown sticker.  These are exceptions, since any bid which shows a weak-2 in either major is not considered brown sticker anymore.

No, only a 2-opening in a minor showing a weak two in either major, is allowed, see link provided by Gerben.
Hey, did Gerben say that multi is a BSC? Did Ron say that what little old Australian ladies play is not BSCs? Not as I read them.

[inquiry]

This is what the WBF says are "brown sticker"

Quote

2.4 Brown Sticker Conventions and Treatments

The following conventions or treatments are categorised as 'Brown Sticker':

a) Any opening bid of two clubs through three spades that:

  i) could be weak (may by agreement be made with values below average strength) AND
  ii) does not promise at least four cards in a known suit.
    EXCEPTION: The bid always shows at least four cards in a known suit if it is weak. If the bid does not show a known four card suit it must show a hand a king or more over average strength. (Explanation: Where all the weak meanings show at least four cards in one known suit, and the strong meanings show a hand with a king or more above average strength, it is not a Brown Sticker Convention.)

    EXCEPTION: A two level opening bid in a minor showing a weak two in either major, whether with or without the option of strong hand types, as described in the WBF Conventions Booklet.



An overcall of a natural opening bid of one of a suit that does not promise at least four cards in a known suit.

    EXCEPTION: A natural overcall in no trumps.
    EXCEPTION: any cue bid suit that shows a strong hand.

    EXCEPTION: a jump cue bid in opponent's known suit that asks partner to bid 3NT with a stopper in that suit.



c) Any 'weak' two-suited bids at the two or three level that may by agreement be made with three cards or fewer in one of the suits.

d) Psychic bids protected by system or required by system.

e) None of the foregoing restrictions pertain to conventional defences against strong, artificial opening bids or defences against 'Brown Sticker' or HUM conventions.

Additional to the classification of systems in 2.3 above, any partnership using one or more 'Brown Sticker' conventions must indicate this alongside its system classification.

2.5 Encrypted Signals

Additional to the restrictions on bidding methods and conventions above, players may not use signalling methods by which the message or messages conveyed by the signals are hidden from the declarer because of some key available only to the defenders (i.e. encrypted signals are not allowed)

2.6 Random Openings

It is forbidden to open hands which, by agreement, may contain fewer than 8 high card points and for which no further definition is provided

So by this definition, an opening bid of 2♠ or 2NT as a preempt in one or the other minors is Brwon sticker, as would be opening bid of 2♠ as any weak preempt just as Free pointed out.

I enjoy playing against brown sticker things. Some people play brwon sticker items because they think they are theoretically sound. Some play them because they find their opponents are not prepared for them so they get an advantage through their opponents not having discussed a defense. Misho preaches Meta defense to thise bids, so that as new ones crop up, you have a framework for dealing with them... this is good idea.

As far as what is allowed, many TD's do not allow Brown Sticker items. But in the main room, and in many many tournments, it quite literally anything goes. Of course in main room if someone is playing brown sticker system, you can just leave and find another table. I like to play multi 2♦, so I tend not to play in the ACBL tournments as they restrict that. I think it is time for ACBL to change that rule. This despite that multi 2♦ is not Brown sticker (see exception above).

Ben

[1eyedjack]

helene_t, on Jul 23 2004, 05:45 AM, said:

May I assume that WBF Brown Sticker regulations apply if nothing else has been specified?

I should have thought that ANYTHING by way of system and conventions is permitted if no restriction has been specified, right down to controlled psyches and encrypted signals.

As you point out, nothing in BBO site rules imposes any restrictions. That is down to TD host.

The International Laws devolve to the sponsor the power to make restrictions. But if that discretion is not exercised the converse is the only logical conclusion.

[Cascade]

Exactly. WBF regulations only apply if the WBF is the sponsoring organization. As far as I know the WBF do not impose their regulations on their members unless they are running an event.

[DrTodd13]

I second (or third or fourth) the opinion that if nothing is said then there are no restrictions. One problem is that we've got tournament hosts who say things like "WBF rules enforced" and they think this means that forcing pass sytems and brown stickers are prohibited. The WBF does determine the conditions of contests for the tourneys it runs and some of these ban brown sticker and forcing pass in certain circumstances. However, nothing about the basic laws of bridge or the WBF ban such things in every circumstance.

Those of us who do play such systems and conventions should be proactive about disclosure and provide suggested defenses so that people are more likely to accept such things into the mainstream in the future.

One note on controlled psyches. This is just a fancy way of saying that you have a convention that a certain bid has two meanings: one orthodox and another a completely different (usually weaker) meaning with subsequent bids that allow differentiation. I'll say it again, the ACBL had to ban controlled psyches because if the people had just said that that was their convention then the existing ACBL rules would have said such a convention was illegal.

[the hog]

Free, why am I totally wrong? Did I say they were not Brown sticker in this thread? No!
What I said was that they are played by lols here, and they are, and are perfectly 100% legal even in normal club duplicates in Australia. Perhaps our lols display more bridge nous that those "experts" who rant and rail against "difficult" conventions.

[Trpltrbl]

That's why many play here, to play anything the want. And I like to play against it, just for the fun of it.

Mike