[wclass___]

For me such high level doubles are 2-way, the auctual meaning to be found in owns hand

South knows about void, 5♣ is not priority...

Btw, this type of double has helped me out several times in various auctions

[bill1157]

wclass___, on Mar 29 2009, 09:28 AM, said:

For me such high level doubles are 2-way, the auctual meaning to be found in owns hand

South knows about void, 5♣ is not priority...

Btw, this type of double has helped me out several times in various auctions

I think what people are trying to say is that they have some agreement in this situation that X by North is for takeout. Thats fine, but in any standard system the X is not takeout. North has made an undisciplined weak 2 with a second suit. I submit that even Al Roth would bid 5♣ over 4♠.
You can't bid 5♣ over pds X btw.

Bill

[helene_t]

bill1157, on Mar 29 2009, 03:43 PM, said:

I think what people are trying to say is that they have some agreement in this situation that X by North is for takeout.

No. It is not an agreement I have ever made with anybody. It's just the standard treatment and I would expect a good p to know this.

Btw, the Dutch top pair Brink/Driver play double by preemptor as penalty after a third-seat preempt at the game level:
p-p-4♥-p
p-4♠-X

The idea is that in third seat, you may open at the game level with a wide range of hands, including some strong hands with considerable defensive values. I don't know how common that treatment is.

[JLOL]

I think Bill is a gimmick account.

[bill1157]

JLOL, on Mar 29 2009, 12:42 PM, said:

I think Bill is a gimmick account.

no, i just seem to have different opinions from the majority.

[jdonn]

bill1157, on Mar 29 2009, 09:43 AM, said:

wclass___, on Mar 29 2009, 09:28 AM, said:

For me such high level doubles are 2-way, the auctual meaning to be found in owns hand

South knows about void, 5♣ is not priority...

Btw, this type of double has helped me out several times in various auctions

I think what people are trying to say is that they have some agreement in this situation that X by North is for takeout. Thats fine, but in any standard system the X is not takeout. North has made an undisciplined weak 2 with a second suit. I submit that even Al Roth would bid 5♣ over 4♠.
You can't bid 5♣ over pds X btw.

Bill

You know, even with the spade void and club suit you have only five hearts. Not everything about the distribution is a positive, partner doesn't need to have four hearts. But this all misses the point. If you think this hand is so far off what partner would expect for a 2♥ opening that you want to bid again later, then don't open 2♥! Can you think of a single reason partner won't have 4♠ absolutely destroyed in his own hand?

Helene is right about double btw. It's standard, whether you know it or not.

[the hog]

jdonn, on Mar 30 2009, 01:18 AM, said:

bill1157, on Mar 29 2009, 09:43 AM, said:

wclass___, on Mar 29 2009, 09:28 AM, said:

For me such high level doubles are 2-way, the auctual meaning to be found in owns hand

South knows about void, 5♣ is not priority...

Btw, this type of double has helped me out several times in various auctions

I think what people are trying to say is that they have some agreement in this situation that X by North is for takeout. Thats fine, but in any standard system the X is not takeout. North has made an undisciplined weak 2 with a second suit. I submit that even Al Roth would bid 5♣ over 4♠.
You can't bid 5♣ over pds X btw.

Bill

You know, even with the spade void and club suit you have only five hearts. Not everything about the distribution is a positive, partner doesn't need to have four hearts. But this all misses the point. If you think this hand is so far off what partner would expect for a 2♥ opening that you want to bid again later, then don't open 2♥! Can you think of a single reason partner won't have 4♠ absolutely destroyed in his own hand?

Helene is right about double btw. It's standard, whether you know it or not.

Good post Josh. Agree with everything you say.