Which is your choice: 7C or 7NT?
#1
Posted 2018-May-31, 22:45
#2
Posted 2018-May-31, 23:45
#3
Posted 2018-June-01, 00:24
Was 2♣ gf? Was 3♣ gf 15+ and 12-14 has to bid a temporising 2♠?
Furthermore I'm not terribly happy to be in a grand on a 5-3 Fit especially lacking any intermediates. I might not be able to pick up Jxxx even if the 10 drops singleton...
Anyhow I'll ask for Kings and if there are 2 I'll bid 7NT if there is only 1 King I'll settle for 7♣ because I might have to promote a 5th/6th ♠ in partners hand by ruffing, intendig to score 4♠, 4 ♥/♦, 5♣ when 7NT will be on a finesse.
regards
JW
#4
Posted 2018-June-01, 01:16
dalmov, on 2018-May-31, 22:45, said:
Is it IMPs or MPs?
You haven't told us your system, but why can't partner hold ♠AJXXX ♥JX ♦JX ♣KQXX. I'm not convinced that your chosen auction has shown you 13 tricks?
In answer to your question, if I were to bid a grand slam, clubs might give me extra tricks / safety and I would choose clubs at IMPs. I would not expect many pairs to bid a grand slam at pairs, so if forced I would choose the likely easier one - clubs.
#5
Posted 2018-June-01, 01:42
The trick with slam bidding is to be able to bid slowly to build up a picture of your partner's hand. The first thing to recognise from the auction is that you have agreed a trump suit ♣s, and that you have an extra card in the suit, and that partner must see as forcing any new suit that is bid, in this instance, ♦s or ♥s. That is the way forward.
#6
Posted 2018-June-01, 03:14
foobar, on 2018-May-31, 23:45, said:
I wouldn't bid 3♣ with that, won't play well opposite the ♣xxxx my partner always holds if I do this, I'd expect him to have 4.
#7
Posted 2018-June-01, 04:15
The system is SAYC, yes! And the response of 5S to 4NT ensures 5 key-cards, as usual. What could they be?
#8
Posted 2018-June-01, 04:25
#10
Posted 2018-June-01, 05:17
DozyDom, on 2018-June-01, 04:32, said:
I don't understand your comment, unless you've replied to the wrong post it's nowhere close to 50%.
What you need for the grand to be good is ♠Axxxx, ♣KQxx and a red king plus SOMETHING else, be that ♠Q, ♥J, the other red K, an extra black card. Even without an extra a 2-2 trump break gets you home and you have plenty of chances if they're 3-1.
I would have cue bid it up, but 5N over 5♠ in the original auction - 6♥(specific K)-7♣ is not unreasonable
#11
Posted 2018-June-01, 06:27
bluerib, on 2018-June-01, 04:25, said:
On the actual hand, 7NT seems to need a successful diamond finesse, whereas 7♣ is ok unless East holds all four trumps or you suffer an early ruff.
A better auction might be 1♠, 2♣; 3♣, 3♦(1); 3NT, 4♣(2); 4♥(3), 4NT; 5♠(4), 5NT; 6♥(5), 7♣
(1) 3♦ will be taken as a NT probe initially
(2) 4♣ slam try in clubs - now suggests that 3♦ was a cue bid (1st or 2nd round control).
(3) 4♥ cue bid (1st or 2nd round control).
(4) 5♠ two key cards + ♣Q
(5) 6♥ king of hearts
#12
Posted 2018-June-01, 08:28
Opposite the ♦K instead of hearts you may be 50-50 for 6nt with 6♣ cold but that ship has sailed although you should have squeeze chances as well.
I do expect partner to have 4-card club support much more often than not but was taught that greed at the slam level is a sin not to mention a grand. 7♣ has many more chances than 7nt either ruffing the spades good or xx, Kx for openers red suits.
The same can be said for 6♣ vs 6nt so cue bidding is the way to go.
What is baby oil made of?
#13
Posted 2018-June-01, 08:53
ggwhiz, on 2018-June-01, 08:28, said:
Opposite the ♦K instead of hearts you may be 50-50 for 6nt with 6♣ cold but that ship has sailed although you should have squeeze chances as well.
Misanalysis, 6N is on a finesse whatever except that partner has ♥J. Also if the OP doesn't show voids to blackwood could be embarrassing if partner was 6034 (5035 is even worse) and couldn't take the finesse, you now need spades 3-3.
#14
Posted 2018-June-02, 04:09
#15
Posted 2018-June-02, 05:05
Maarten Baltussen
#16
Posted 2018-June-02, 09:17
dalmov, on 2018-May-31, 22:45, said:
I disagree with those who want to cue bid; we want to know about AS and KQC once we get the nod on those using RKCB our next bid is 5N. Now with both red Kings partner bids 7C which we convert to 7N. In this case he will bid 6H and we will bid 7C because we have extra chances by ruffing spades.
If I start cue bidding, partner might do something stupid like bidding 5C, in which case I will probably have to settle for 6 or punt 7 with little to go on.
PS It would be nice to have 4C or 4D agreed as minorwood. It does not matter here, but, other times, we can't afford the luxury of 4N
#17
Posted 2018-June-02, 10:35
Cyberyeti, on 2018-June-01, 05:17, said:
What you need for the grand to be good is ♠Axxxx, ♣KQxx and a red king plus SOMETHING else, be that ♠Q, ♥J, the other red K, an extra black card. Even without an extra a 2-2 trump break gets you home and you have plenty of chances if they're 3-1.
I would have cue bid it up, but 5N over 5♠ in the original auction - 6♥(specific K)-7♣ is not unreasonable
I think you were saying AQxxx xxx xx KQJ isn't a 3C bid; I meant that the grand is still not good if p has AQxxx xx xx KQJx, which is a definite 3C bid.
#18
Posted 2018-June-02, 14:43
nekthen, on 2018-June-02, 09:17, said:
If I start cue bidding, partner might do something stupid like bidding 5C, in which case I will probably have to settle for 6 or punt 7 with little to go on.
PS It would be nice to have 4C or 4D agreed as minorwood. It does not matter here, but, other times, we can't afford the luxury of 4N
I don't see why you distrust partner during cue bidding but not in RKCB, but I agree that RKCB is enough in this case.
As you say, 4NT is generally an unaffordable luxury with minors.
We use Crosswood - 4♣ over ♦ and 4♦ over ♣ - and find it works well.
A bonus is that you can easily extend the same scheme to preempts - 4♦ over 3/4 ♣ and 4♣ over 2/3 anything else - instead of playing preempt RKCB.
#19
Posted 2018-June-02, 16:04
DozyDom, on 2018-June-02, 10:35, said:
And I wouldn't bid it opposite that, would bid 6♣ when partner has no red K, note the grand is not solid even if partner has 5 spade tricks.
My actual auction would involve either 4♦ asking for aces leaving the space to ask for a red king or cue bids before 4N to establish no red K then 6♣.
#20
Posted 2018-June-02, 18:30
None of these are part of SAYC.
How you get Minorwood, Crossword or my personal favourite Kickback into SAYC when SAYC doesn't even have a forcing raise of 1 of a minor I don't know? <end sarcasm>